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Rear wheel bearings failure

25K views 79 replies 33 participants last post by  vrakas 
#1 ·
REAR AXIL BEARINGS ARE FAILING.I have seen some threads on the f800s/st side but very little information on the gs side.
I have read a lot about the rear bearing issue on the ADVrider site and I'm concerned the information is not getting out. VERY VERY important to check those rear bearings. I change my own tires so I was doing it anyway. If someone else is changing your tires please have them CHECK the bearings for any sign af failure. Lost hubs maybe even lost lives are at stake here.
btw, at 5100 miles my rear bearing on the rotor side his rough. Taking the bike to the dealer, Woodys wheel shop in Denver recommended on the ADVrider site to get the dealers involved. maybe a design problem with the rear axil.
If anyone else has seen problems let us know. I post what happens at the dealer.ride safe <>< Craigster
 
#2 ·
I never expected that a non swing arm bike will ever have a bearing failure.

I know for sure that it happens very rarely….but…..back at 80s

I believe that it smells like China!!!! (No offense to any Chinese)

At least for my F800ST, I believe that it is more than 55% Chinese and I have no longer any doubt about it. Although I cannot prove it!!!!

Those thinks are ridiculous.
 
#3 ·
There have been several rear wheel bearing failures.

In the "search" facility type "Rear Wheel Bearing Kerfuffle" and read on.

One UK rider had his lock-up on him which, to an inexperienced rider, could have resulted in a nasty accident.
 
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#4 ·
If the GS didn't ride so darn good it would have been gone long ago for a KTM...
Might want to spend some time on the KTM forums before you go that route. If you think your BMW has issues, you will find some real horror stories with KTM's. I know. I've owned one.

About the bearings - it may be cheap parts in combination with lack of maintenance. I will definitely be looking for replacement bearings before I need them. I have 7,000 miles on my F658 and the bearings checked out fine upon inspection. I lubed them up good with Bel-ray waterproof grease, however, some things aren't worth risking. The bearings and chain are getting replaced soon.

BTW, does anyone know what size bearings these are and where to shop for high quality replacements?
 
#5 ·
I also thought that this was only an S/ST problem. BMW has been building single-sided swingarms for way too long to have these kind of issues. I'm checking my ST almost weekly, and I swear, if I find something this serious is wrong with my bike, I'm telling BMW financial to come pick it up.

However, I still think this is a very small percentage of bikes that are having this problem...but it's still inexcusable. This is way beyond "minor bugs" that can be expected with a new model.
 
#6 ·
bike is at the dealer

I had the rear wheel assembly in the back of the truck ready to remove the bearings. I called the dealer before begining the disassembly. He said to bring the bike up and they would look into it. He also stated that if I replaced the bearings myself that it would be hard to cover any future issues under warrenty.There is also concern on the safety so I hauled the bike up in the back of the truck. First let me say the dealer has been super on all the issues concerning the bike. I feel bad when I call because it is in a negitive context most of the time. (maybe the maytag repairman might want in on some of the action)[lol].
Having said all that let me say that when this bike is in the grove it has to be one of the best bikes in the world!! I have put some 5000 + miles and like the bike better all the time. Bmw, please take on the issues and resolve them for past and future owners.
fyi... the # for the National Highway traffic Safety Administration is on page 134 of your owners manual. (if the problem isn't resolved by BMW) Bsafe <>< Craigster
ps keep you posted on the bike repairs.
 
#7 ·
I had the rear wheel assembly in the back of the truck ready to remove the bearings. I called the dealer before begining the disassembly. He said to bring the bike up and they would look into it. He also stated that if I replaced the bearings myself that it would be hard to cover any future issues under warrenty.There is also concern on the safety so I hauled the bike up in the back of the truck. First let me say the dealer has been super on all the issues concerning the bike. I feel bad when I call because it is in a negitive context most of the time. (maybe the maytag repairman might want in on some of the action)[lol].
Having said all that let me say that when this bike is in the grove it has to be one of the best bikes in the world!! I have put some 5000 + miles and like the bike better all the time. Bmw, please take on the issues and resolve them for past and future owners.
fyi... the # for the National Highway traffic Safety Administration is on page 134 of your owners manual. (if the problem isn't resolved by BMW) Bsafe <>< Craigster
ps keep you posted on the bike repairs.
So what type/brand of bearing are you having them replace with? Surely not the BMW "stock" bearing?
 
#8 ·
what bearing they will use for replacement

The Dealer stated that he had the stock bearing available and would use that for replacement of the defective bearing. The bike is under warranty so I guess that will be OEM replacement. If I want I might be able to supply a alternative manufactures bearing if it met BMW specs but BNW wouldn't cover the cost. I suspect something else it going on for theses bearings to be failing so soon and no bearing will hold up until they figure it out. Hope they figure it out before the warranty goes out.
Again the dealer was very responsive to my concerns. Be sure to pass the word on checking the bearings and ride safe <>< Craigster
 
#9 ·
I suspect something else it going on for theses bearings to be failing so soon and no bearing will hold up until they figure it out. Hope they figure it out before the warranty goes out.


I tell you what is the problem....

Chinese surplus products with very poor QA and QC.

I truly believe that only the design and part of final assembly is made in Germany. The rest is China.
 
#10 ·
1997 F650 Funduros had a similar problem with the steering bearings. Mine became seriously notched around 8000 miles and I was able to get BMW to warrant the replacement of the $5 Bulgarian bearing, with another stock Bulgarian bearing. I had no further problems with the bike over the following 30,000 miles. The problem was that the Aprilia factory (or maybe it was the Bulgarians that greased the bearing) that installed the bearings used the wrong type of grease. The bearing was subject to heat from the oil that was stored in the frame. The grease got hot and just ran down the headstock. When the new bearing was installed, the dealer used a quality high-temperature wheel bearing grease and that solved that problem. Apparently, BMW got the message as the following year's bikes had no further problem with steering bearings - but the 1999 bikes did have stalling problems due the mis-routing of the charcoal canister vacuum hose at the factory.
 
#11 ·
bikes back with new bearings and theory !!!

I dropped off my bike last Tuesday and got the call it was ready today. Drove up and picked up the bike. He said the he replaced all three bearings and both seals and would turn it in under warranty. Kudos to the dealer for great service !!!
Now for the interesting theory of what might be causing the premature bearing failure.When I took up the bike I just threw the wheel on and tighten up the chain without torquing the axil bolt or setting the chain tension. When he called he asked if that is how tight I have been keeping the chain tension. I said I didn't even set it. just moved the bike 100 feet to load on my truck. When I got there the chain looked to have more play then the owners manual specs state. I'm pretty good about keeping things right and have maintained the 1.4 to 1.8 " chain sag as per the manual including the bike on level ground, unloaded on side stand when setting chain sag. The dealer stated that it should have a small amount of play even when loaded and bottomed out where the swing arm would be at the maximin distance. That would explain the heavy force on the bearing if the chain is ever in a situation where it would not only transfer power from the driver to the driving (engine/transmission to rear sprocket/tire) but also become part of the suspension. If that was the case the maximum force would go the the rotor side bearing on the rear and the inner bearing of the final drive gear shaft from the transmission. Catch that part about transmission.[:0] I'll throw that out for debate
. Thanks <>< Craigster
 
#12 ·
I have purchased some 38 new motorcycles during my 48 year riding career. Almost every one had a chain that was over-tightened when I picked the bike up from the dealer. Apparently, the people who set up bikes believe that the chain will stretch a lot when new and that the owner will never adjust the chain and they believe that setting the chain too tight will correct those issues. Wrong! All it does is put a lot of load on the components. After picking up a bike, when I get home I almost always need to readjust the chain slack to spec. Even the electric motorcycle that I just bought had a very tight chain that could not even be deflected when I would push hard on the chain run. What made it worse is that the counter-shaft sprocket is located nowhere near the swing-arm pivot. I had to loosen the chain adjusters 1/3 inch in order to get the chain slack properly adjusted. Always check the chain tension when you buy a new bike. A too tight chain can certainly result in severe bearing and chain loads and potential excessive wear and failure of drive train components if not corrected soon.
 
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#14 ·
How is this for a chain? Anyone sell size 420 chain in a 140-link long package? Also check out the distance between the swing arm pivot and the counter shaft sprocket. Fortunately, the rear shocks don't have much travel. The specified chain slack is 15-20 mm:
 

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#15 ·
new bearings

I went for a 180 mile trip last weekend, wanted to test the new rear Mitas E09 tire and dealer replaced bearings. The Mitas worked well on mud,sand, twistys and rocks,will wait for a wet road and hopefully live to tell how that works out [:)]. When I took my seat to the custom shop for an upgrade I decided to go in and check the new bearings. The two outer bearings are Taiwan mfg. and the inner bearing ??. I did pop off all three bearing seals and saw a little grease in there. I did not add any grease to bearings (big no no unless old grease is removed).btw, I did not see any grease in the original bearings. Just buttoned it up and cleaned and greased seal area.
<>< Craigster
 
#16 ·
I did not add any grease to bearings (big no no unless old grease is removed).btw, <>< Craigster
Craigster, could you let us know why this is a no no. I have always just repacked with fresh grease without thorough cleaning, unless the bearing was gritty that is.

Thanks
 
#17 ·
When i got my bike the chain free play was out of specs, when i asked the dealer, they said that it is ok and that the chain will stretch soon.
To my knowledge this was wrong and could lead to wheel/gearbox bearing and frame failure so i have readjusted the chain and also made sure that there is a small play when the wheel axle-swing arm pivot point and front sprocket are on the same plane.
A friend of mine had the chain free play wrong on his Honda AX-1 and the result was to end up with a broken frame.
So new bike owners, do check your chain before even riding the bike, after all if you end up with a chain being a bit on the loose side, you dealer will adjust it 600 miles later
 
#18 ·
grease mixing

Kelsow. The way I understand it the problem is when you mix grease. Different types and manufactures use different additives in there grease, some of the additives can actually break down the lubrication qualities of different grease types. I would be open for comment. <>< Craigster
 
#20 ·
Spent the morning up at Woodys Wheel Works in Denver yesterday. I really think anyone riding a gs needs to know about this issue.

A very long thread in ADVrider has been going for a while concerning the failure of the rear bearings, with all sorts of speculations, but Woody spent the morning trying to decifer the real cause of the problem. Bottom line in laymans terms - the hub is too small for that particular bearing and puts to much "crush" on it, causing them to fail. Replacing the bearings is not going to solve the problem for very long.

THe thread is here: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=499504&page=42 Skip to the last several pages to get the just of it. My post #625 tells of the morning at Woodys.

Woodys post is here: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=505577 You can scroll down to post #15 to read his final vedict.

Being a noobie in the internet forum world I'm not sure what the best way to get the word out is, but I do think it is important.
 
#22 ·
Fred, you could buy a fully-electric motorcycle like I have. All you need to do is plug it in and oil the chain. Since the motorcycle chassis is made by Tiger in Thailand and there is no service manual, torque values, maintenance instructions, parts diagrams or anywhere you can buy individual parts for the chassis - you don't need to worry about any of this stuff and therefore there is no need to maintain it. :rolleyes: Just ride and enjoy - until the juice runs out.
 
#24 ·
Picked my bike up from the dealer today. It was in getting its' scheduled service. This is the second time the dealer has had the back wheel off and it is the second time I have found the chain to be too tight and not aligned properly when I got home.

A chain that is too tight will certainly have an effect on bearing wear.
 
#25 ·
Replaced bad rear wheel bearings

Rear Wheel Bearing Repair and Replacement BMW F800GS
Build date 07/08, 8800 miles

After following various forum posts and reading Woody's description of the wheel he repaired. I removed the rear wheel of my F800GS motorcycle Sunday to check the wheel bearings. The left (disc) side felt rough and notchy. The right (drive) side felt notchy too, but less than the left. I couldn't tell if it was transferring across the wheel through the spacer. The bearing in the drive sprocket hub felt smooth.
I disassembled the wheel and measured the bores and bearings and found a press fit of 0.003" tight, on the left (disc) side and a press fit of 0.002" tight, on the right (drive) side. Both bearings felt smoother after they were removed from their bores, however sight roughness was still apparent.
I honed both bores to achieve a press fit of 0.001" (N7) tolerance to new SKF 6204 2RS bearings, heated the hub to 200˚ F and installed the disc side bearing and snap ring and then repeated the heating on the drive side and installed the drive side bearing. When cooled and seated the assembly rotated smoothly and correctly with no feeling of roughness.
I filed a report with the NHTSB and received confirmation yesterday.
 
#35 ·
this is the REAL reason for the F800GS bearing failures

Rear Wheel Bearing Repair and Replacement BMW F800GS
Build date 07/08, 8800 miles

After following various forum posts and reading Woody's description of the wheel he repaired. I removed the rear wheel of my F800GS motorcycle Sunday to check the wheel bearings. The left (disc) side felt rough and notchy. The right (drive) side felt notchy too, but less than the left. I couldn't tell if it was transferring across the wheel through the spacer. The bearing in the drive sprocket hub felt smooth.
I disassembled the wheel and measured the bores and bearings and found a press fit of 0.003" tight, on the left (disc) side and a press fit of 0.002" tight, on the right (drive) side. Both bearings felt smoother after they were removed from their bores, however sight roughness was still apparent.
I honed both bores to achieve a press fit of 0.001" (N7) tolerance to new SKF 6204 2RS bearings, heated the hub to 200˚ F and installed the disc side bearing and snap ring and then repeated the heating on the drive side and installed the drive side bearing. When cooled and seated the assembly rotated smoothly and correctly with no feeling of roughness.
I filed a report with the NHTSB and received confirmation yesterday.
hi,,had a bunch of disgruntled F800GS riders ask me to chime in...
i did this morning accidentally replying to a thread called rear wheel bearing failures in your Hall of wisdom section,,
so here's my post #10 and 12

http://f800riders.org/forum/showthread.php?t=40726

kudos to gigsrider for doing it the scientific way,,you will experience no more problems,,you arrived at the same measurements as i found in a dozen other bad hubs,,,and ya honed it to the correct specs ,,,essentially .005'' crush per inch of bearing diameter[thumb][thumb]

kudos to Owl for spreading the word

bottom line is ONLY settle for arepair ,,a new hub or a new wheel and go to your dealer and report it ,,,if all else fails ya know who can do it,,,

if there any other issues i can help with just holler

woody
 
#26 ·
Hey gjgsrider,
That was my wheel Woody worked on. Your measurments and the feelings of the bearings in and out of the hub seemed to be nearly identical with mine. Nice you have the tools to do that. Glad to see you reported it as well. Hope some solution is offered real soon by BMW.
 
#27 ·
Just replaced mine

My rear bearing (the one on the rotor side) was shot. 2009 bike with just under 10,000 miles on it. It had sideways play in it to the point where the rotor actually started rubbing on the ABS sensor and the caliper mount. [:0][:0]

I just got my bike back from the dealership today. They replaced the bearings and seals. Seems ok for now, but who knows.

Aloha,
Charlie
 
#28 · (Edited)
REAR AXIL BEARINGS ARE FAILING.I have seen some threads on the f800s/st side but very little information on the gs side.
I have read a lot about the rear bearing issue on the ADVrider site and I'm concerned the information is not getting out. VERY VERY important to check those rear bearings. If anyone else has seen problems let us know. I post what happens at the dealer.ride safe <>< Craigster
If you notice my post below, my F50 is still in the shop with a rear bearing failure!
http://f800riders.org/forum/showthread.php?t=33047

According to my BMW dealer, this is very rare.. but according to this board, BMW needs to really look into quality control for the F series. My F50 has been in the shop; since, last Friday --so after a week not all the parts are in. If the rear bearings are replaced with cheap rear bearings and this happens again, I will also be stranded [xx(] So what happens if I really want to tour with my F50 and put 300+mi a day this bike like I did with my Goldwings. Granted I have my R12 as backup.. so does this mean that the F50 models are only good for around town. I had no problem detected the wheel bearing going bad, so I know what it feels like before it seizes. If this is common on the BMW F series then I will also get rid of my F50 by this summer and keep my BMW R12 [:)] Very sad as I've had my F50 for less than a year, even though warranties their bike for 3 years.
 
#31 ·
If you notice my post below, my F50 is still in the shop with a rear bearing failure!
http://f800riders.org/forum/showthread.php?t=33047

According to my BMW dealer, this is very rare.. but according to this board, BMW needs to really look into quality control for the F series. My F50 has been in the shop; since, last Friday --so after a week not all the parts are in. If the rear bearings are replaced with cheap rear bearings and this happens again, I will also be stranded [xx(] So what happens if I really want to tour with my F50 and put 300+mi a day this bike like I did with my Goldwings. Granted I have my R12 as backup.. so does this mean that the F50 models are only good for around town. I had no problem detected the wheel bearing going bad, so I know what it feels like before it seizes. If this is common on the BMW F series then I will also get rid of my F50 by this summer and keep my BMW R12 [:)] Very sad as I've had my F50 for less than a year, even though warranties their bike for 3 years.
Rick, since this is going to take so long, did they offer you a loaner bike?
 
#29 ·
Don't feel bad, I have a 04 Ducati Multistrada. This summer the rear sub frame failed and left the back end from the pillion seat back dangling by the exhaust only.
I was horrified, had I had a passenger on the back it would have been game over for both of us.
It was an easy fix and also classified as a rare event, not so rare if it happens to you.
The Buell Ulysses also has suffered from rear wheel bearing failures.
Don't know if your R12 is a GS or RT but as you know the GS has been known to suffer from rear drive failures.

Hard to find a true "no issues" motorcycle, I have yet to find one.
 
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