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The day your bike disappears...

9K views 78 replies 24 participants last post by  Thumpin 
#1 ·
No, this isn't about a bike being stolen. It's about that point in your riding history when you are no longer a rider guiding your bike through corners and going to destinations toward which you've aimed your bike. It's about the day when you're riding, after many years, and - suddenly - your bike disappears. It's the day when your mind is the vehicle, and the machine you're mounted on is the propulsion. It's the day when a thought becomes your reality and instead of the bike taking you into a corner, or to a destination, it's YOU who is taking the bike to those places. It's the day when you don't even feel you're on a bike, but that you're a disembodied spirit that can flow like water around a bend, and fly like a hawk to a far-off place. It's a revelation. It must be what riding is meant to be, because it's the greatest feeling on earth. You are no longer a passenger, you're no longer just a "rider", you're the bike...and the bike is you.

By the way, the GT is a bike that I've grown to understand only gradually. But that understanding reached a new level today, leading to the above "commentary". I've got a RR also, and think it's a magical machine, but for some reason today I found a depth of respect for the GT that I had no idea was possible.

Thanks for reading...[:)]
 

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#34 ·
It certainly happens in a particular time/place. I've recently come back from a trip into the Highlands on the bike and there were certainly some rides & places which become very serene - regardless of the weather. A bike moves the body and the soul. The interaction you have with a bike makes it an existential part of you, your input makes the bike respond. Unlike in a car where you do something, which tells the computer to do something which moves the thing. . . . .
 
#38 · (Edited)
For a 5'1" rider, the ST is a bit on the tall side...and it's not a lightweight bike. Years ago, when I took a motorcycle safety course, we were given a choice of riding their bikes or our own. Several guys showed up with their Harley's and rode them. I chose the course's bike...a Suzuki 125. I passed with flying colors, but the guys with the bigger bikes could not do the obstacle course to save their lives.

We all have probably dropped a bike at least once, so I wouldn't be too critical here. If I were Zee, I'd think about a bike with less reach to the ground, and lighter weight. Maybe even a BMW 310R...unless a big bike with touring capability is the goal. But for any rider just starting out, a smaller bike is always a good idea.

BMW F800ST seat height: 33"
BMW G310R seat height: 30.9"
 
#39 · (Edited)
Thank you, Elizdad, just saw your post. I appreciate the concern, for sure. And, no worries, I am glad to get counsel and advice from you all! I opted to get a lighter bike to learn on and practice slow maneuvering, as that has been my problem. I am careful and I'm learning lots. I'd rather make a mistake at a slow speed or dead stop than at high speeds, for obvious reasons. Thank you!
 
#41 ·
I'm always nervous about recommending someone practice in a parking lot. :) I guess it is because I know myself. I wouldn't let well enough alone, so I'd start with large circles and once I got confident, I'd go to tighter circles, then even tighter circles, and then even still tighter circles...till I got to the point that I dropped the bike. [B)]

I practice my turning when I get the mail. Depending on the direction, I have to make a U-turn in the street. It's heavily cambered and the driveway has a large hump to get over and then goes steeply downhill. I review in my head the basics, and then try to follow through. It's enough for me. :)

When I went to Baker Lake the other day, the group went down a road and had to make a U-turn. It was sloping pavement and on gravel. Two of the riders did a good job of making the U-turn. Two of us decided to play it safe and took the turn in two parts, letting the bike roll backwards a few feet to get less of a turn on the steering in the gravel. It doesn't bother me, and I would rather play it safe. If needed, I'd even get off the bike and push it, if I didn't feel comfortable. I have nothing to prove to anyone. :)

Lane positioning is a skill that doesn't get the attention it deserves. I don't have "close calls". I've hit my brakes hard maybe 6 or 7 times in the last 14 years and 160,000 miles of commuting in Seattle. And two of those were for the GEICO squirrel and Bambi's auntie a few minutes later. My last "accident" was in England 39 years ago, and I brushed myself off and continued on home.

Once you get above parking lot speeds, there is a whole different skill set that will keep you alive.

Have you taken a rider training course? When I took the Advanced Rider Course, they spotted things that I had no idea I was doing. And that was in the first 15 minutes.

Chris
 
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#44 ·
Sophie, try checking out from the library a book by David Hough, Proficient Motorcycling.

Here's an article on cornering by David Hough. It's part 1 with a link to part 2 at the end. https://soundrider.com/archive/safety-skills/RS-cc1.aspx

Here's an article on lane positioning. I can quickly tell a newbie rider by where they ride. A quick example would be that they hide along the side of the road in the HOV lane where they can't be seen. Then they wonder why a car tries to move into their space.
http://www.motorcyclebasics.com/lane-position.html

Chris
 
#46 · (Edited)
I'm not sure it IS vital in the real world, except that if you can maneuver a bike at low speed it says something about your understanding of motorcycle physics, which IS vital in the real world. One thing that always blows my mind is how "counter-steering" can be difficult for people to grasp...we all do it automatically, yet it's apparently a big mystery to many.

Pretty good slow-speed maneuvering video:

 
#48 ·
First, my GT disappeared...then today my RR disappeared. What a phenomenal ride. Late day, absolutely transparent air...hills, mountains in bold relief, and the river sparkling with late-day sun diamonds. Cornering was like a perfect day skiing...every turn carved the way a surgeon performs in the OR. Even better...the weekend traffic had disappeared as well, so that all the way up-canyon I had clear road...and the same, for the most part, on the way down. It was one of those rides you remember long after it's done.

I hope I dream about this ride tonight...[:)]
 
#55 ·
Zee, who's a pilot, will get this, but it applies to riding as well: "Never stop learning". When I was flying, I learned something new on every flight...same with riding. But the most important thing pilots and riders possess is something they already have - the ability to think. Almost anyone can learn to manipulate the controls of an airplane, or a motorcycle, but what makes someone a "pilot" or a "rider" is the facility of being able to think ahead, to anticipate what might occur in the next few seconds or minutes. If you simply fire up your bike, hop on and head down the road without an awareness of yourself and your environment, you may find yourself surprised by the unexpected. It happens to us all. Even though I considered myself a "good" pilot, and now a "good" motorcyclist, if I don't have a little internal tension before going out to ride, a little "fear factor" as it were, I know I'm not in the right frame of mind to consider all the possibilities I might encounter on a ride.

A ride like yesterday's is a beautiful thing, and I hope to have many more. But if I had to put that ride's success down to one thing, it would be this - "being present". Riding and flying are zen-like activities, and if you're not fully present in the moment, something has to pay the price, and that's usually something minor, hopefully. I've done some dumb things on a bike, and I can trace every single one to a lack of being present.

This is a great sport, and a beautiful one. It's a ballet, it's a work of art...and a visceral thrill. The more thought you put into it, the more thrilling it becomes. Those MotoGP riders are at the pinnacle of what I mean...300 hp on a 350 pound bike, in traffic with other racers at 200 mph? Try doing that with your mind elsewhere!

Have fun...!
 
#56 ·
Oh Sophie...you will always drop your bike. There are two groups of people who ride. Those who have dropped their bike, and those who will drop their bike.

I live on a hill with a one car width driveway going down to three houses. On one of my earlier bikes, I was part way up the hill when I wondered, "Did I close the garage door?" So I tried to do a tight turn on that narrow driveway. I lost my balance, and dropped it. And did I drop it on the uphill side where it had less distance to fall? Nooooo. :D I dropped it on the downhill side.

This is in the winter and I'm all bundled up for an hour long commute at probably 40F. So I get the bike vertical with a lot of effort and now a lot of sweat too...and the bike tips over to the uphill side. Ugh!!! It was bad enough to have scratches on one side, but now I've put scratches on both sides of my beautiful bike. I looked around. It was dark everywhere, with just a few lights on from people getting up for the day. And I just laughed. There was nothing to do, but laugh or cry, so I chose to laugh at how silly it would've looked if anyone had seen me.

Chris
 
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#57 ·
Oh Sophie...you will always drop your bike. There are two groups of people who ride. Those who have dropped their bike, and those who will drop their bike.
I've got a story. When I had my 2012 ST, I was getting ready to move it onto the center stand from the side stand. I was in the garage, next to a set of wooden steps. Somehow the bike got unbalanced and started to tip...toward me. Fortunately, the top of the stair steps was right behind me, and I sat down with the bike in my lap. No damage to the bike, because it didn't go to ground. But...I was stuck. The weight of the bike was more than I could lift from a sitting position, and I couldn't get up for the same reason. My wife was in the house and I had the good luck to have my cell phone in a Kriega bag on the luggage rack. I was able to reach the bag and extract the phone. I called my wife and said, "Honey, are you busy at the moment?" She said, "No". I said, "Could you come out to the garage for a minute? I need a little help with something." She came into the garage via the side door, where the steps were...and burst out laughing. I admit...it WAS funny, though if she hadn't been home, maybe not so much. We got the bike off me and I successfully put it on the center stand.
 
#64 · (Edited)
https://soundrider.com/archive/safety-skills/RS-cc1.aspx

The illustration in the above-referenced article regarding countersteering (which I understand) has me wondering...if you push the handlebar to the right, you're turning right. So why does it show the bike leaning left?

Ha, ha, just figured it out. The illustration shows the rider coming towards you, not away from you. Now it makes sense!
 
#68 ·
https://soundrider.com/archive/safety-skills/RS-cc1.aspx

The illustration in the above-referenced article regarding countersteering (which I understand) has me wondering...if you push the handlebar to the right, you're turning right. So why does it show the bike leaning left??
as far as how it works, don't have a clue - i just know it does -
Elizdad's last sentence really says it for me. I think it was flyrider who earlier said you have to think...and that's true. But the other part of having your bike disappear is to not overthink it. Just do it.

If you're riding a twisty road ...do you really want to be thinking about which way do I push on the handlebars to make that left turn? Or is it that I need to pull on the handlebar? Oh my gosh, the corner is coming up on me! Which way???!!!

Just do it. If you have the ability to ride all the time, do so. And when you get to the point where you are no longer thinking about the bike, but it is just an extension of your mind and body...it will disappear. And it is a glorious feeling.

Chris
 
#65 ·
i don't know - i learned push left, go left ------ leaning was never part of it -

lucky for me, i'm not that smart, so i don't usually try to understand things - i leave that to the experts - i just follow the advice i hear if it makes sense and it works - i practice countersteering EVERY time i ride -

as far as how it works, don't have a clue - i just know it does -
 
#66 ·
Counter-steering isn't a mystery, and we really don't need to think about it. When you do it and see how it helps the bike turn, it's an automatic reflex. Somebody must've made a big deal out of it once and started all this talk about the "arcane" practice of counter-steering.

You CAN turn a bike by leaning, but it's slow, imprecise and in tight twisties, not the most efficient way to get a bike leaned over. In fact, I doubt you could make it around a corner just by leaning, unless it was a slow, gradual sweeper.
 
#67 ·
28. Motorcycle riders in these accidents showed significant collision avoidance problems. Most riders would overbrake and skid the rear wheel, and underbrake the front wheel greatly reducing collision avoidance deceleration. The ability to countersteer and swerve was essentially absent.

sorry flyrider, but i'm gonna have to disagree -
 
#69 ·
the fault in all this steering confusion, clearly falls in the hands of our loving but seriously misguided parents, who in our most formative years introduced us to those 3-wheeled death-traps, innocently known as tricycles - "Johnny, just turn the handlebars this way if you want to go this way - and if you want to go that way, turn the handlebars that way" -------- all well and good for the next few years till we met our nemesis, the bicycle - "ok Johnny, just like on your tricycle, if you want to go this way ..........................."

thanks mom and dad !
 
#73 ·
I thought of this thread yesterday. I was riding up the Mt. Baker Highway with James (jtvisions). There was no one in front of us, and even little traffic coming towards us. It was a beautiful day, and like I told James, there's a point where everything seems effortless.

The day was perfect. One corner after another just disappeared and the GT was like a dancer who responds to your every move perfectly.

All to soon, the leaves will fall and the rain will come (tomorrow :( ), and that effortless feeling will go away along with the clean roads and dry pavement. But for several hours yesterday, that magical moment was there and it felt really good.

Chris
 
#75 ·
I have it "good" here. I can ride virtually all winter...but not like this. The first storm comes through tomorrow. Tree limbs will be down. Wet soggy leaves on the road. I can still ride, but it isn't the same.

Yesterday was this wonderful pace. No worries. Just this smooth feeling as I was riding fast, but well within mine and the bike's capabilities.

Starting tomorrow, it'll be a little more cautious. Did the rains cause the hillside to wash out? Or did the farmer drive out on the road carrying a bunch of mud on his tires? When it is here, summer is glorious time to be riding in the Pacific Northwet.

Chris
 
#76 ·
I agree Chris! Got some really good rides in this summer here in the great PNW. Despite all the madness going on. I’m really digging the GS. So sad summer is gone. We were planing one more ride this weekend but the weather is not cooperating with the storm coming. Gonna see how it looks on Friday. 👍🏽
 
#77 ·
If allowed. Here a few good uTube channels to help with slow speed riding.

MotoJitsu
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0FFFneMi9GwRHUsuBjM0jA

MC rider
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCC4gEs8RahtTYiBqsiziudQ

CanyonChasers
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiUNhNOpGImlrr06ZZ-zWQg

MotoTrek
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWh6PvzNVeOmEU065h-8kUw

FortNine
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNSMdQtn1SuFzCZjfK2C7dQ

No affiliation. Just some very good current information and techniques.
I am subed to all of them. These my help Sophie and others.

~James~
 
#78 ·
Well after 14 years and 127K miles my old F800s fits me like an old pair of trainers. I don't have to think about riding it, it just responds.
I often ride with more powerful bikes with all the electronic aids you can imagine yet a nice set of fast bends and they fall behind.
In fact the f800S fits so well the next bike will likely be the GT.
 
#79 ·
I have been riding bicycles for about 60 years and motorcycles for 50 years -and in my prime I was a pretty successful competitor in Motocross and Hare Scrambles and was normally in the top 3 places at any amateur event.

When I first heard/read about Countersteering 20 years ago it seemed like an odd and slightly unbelievable concept. The next time I got on my motorcycle I lightly held the handlebars and put a small amount of forward pressure on the end of the left handlebar.....and the bike leaned left and turned left! Dang - why hadn't I figured this out earlier? All those years of riding by instinct never revealed the true nature of how I was steering!

Now that I am "WOKE" and aware of how the rider initiates a turn......and what is going on when I stand the bike up at the exit of the turn.....I have become a better rider. This is most evident in those instances when an instant course correction becomes necessary - as I understand that no amount of leaning or body english is going to get the motorcycle and rider to change direction instantly......countersteering will get the fast direction change that is needed.

Seat time is really beneficial in becoming a better rider - but spending time practicing things outside your current riding level is also beneficial. Mentally focus on the countersteering, practice hard braking so you get used to loading the front tire prior to applying a big handful of front brake, practice quick avoidance steering so you can miss the pothole or puppy when you need to. And stay safe!
 
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