Balance beads on the 700GS rims - BMW F800 Riders Forum & Registry



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    Has anyone used balance beads in the F700GS OEM rims, I'm wondering if they are compatible with the valve stem on the front and the tire pressure monitors? Can you install them with the wheels mounted and on the bike? Also which brand to buy?

    I can never seem to get a decent shake when it comes to mounting & balancing wheels and tires,,.

    I recall the OEM setup to be pretty good with very few wts from the factory, two on one wheel and none on the other,,. Now I have 12 weights on the back and six on the front and I find that starting at 80 mph the front seems very course & with handlebar vibrations and gets progressively worse as the speed increases,,. 80 mph is the point where the engine RPM is getting up into the 6000's so maybe this is a factor as well,,.
    Not sure if I'm expecting to much? ,,,,,,,,,,Comments would be welcomed?

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    The dealer used to try to sell me on whatever they put in the tires so the stuff may work. I just never bought into it.
    There are plenty of folks that adhere to the science of it. Worth a try, I guess. The tire shouldn't get funky at 80 mph.

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    Thanks

    Yes I've read enough reviews that they sound worth a try, at least this way I can run the bike, switch the balance to the beads and run a test just to see the difference, other wise I would wait for the tire change,,.

    I would still like to confirm if they can be installed past the TPMS sensors?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lag View Post
    Thanks

    Yes I've read enough reviews that they sound worth a try, at least this way I can run the bike, switch the balance to the beads and run a test just to see the difference, other wise I would wait for the tire change,,.

    I would still like to confirm if they can be installed past the TPMS sensors?
    The TPMS in my R1200RS wheels looks too large to let anything past it in my opinion. On my bike it sits right in the middle of the center of the wheel rim.
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Yes, Richard, thats my concern,,. I think you might have to break the bead and put them inside,,. The kits come with stem removers and certain tools however I'm not sure if there's a get around the sensors,,.
    If anyone has put beads in a F700GS OEM rim I would love to hear from them,,. Cant find anything specific on the net,,!!

    Thanks,,.

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    My guess is that breaking the tire bead to insert the beads would be what you would need to do to insert them into the tire. That might be possible with the wheel still mounted on the bike using a large C-clamp to break the bead on one side of the wheel, while placing a piece of wood on the other side to protect the wheel rim. The rear tire's bead can be a bugger to break, though. Unfortunately, I have no idea where the TPMS is located in the F700GS's wheel and how large it is. Perhaps checking out the bike's parts fiche on the Max BMW site might provide a hint to its location and size. Or maybe looking for a YouTube video regarding how to replace the pressure sensing device's battery might be a better idea.
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Looks like there is a small hole that protrudes right through the sensor?
    same as the 1200GS

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lag View Post
    Looks like there is a small hole that protrudes right through the sensor?
    same as the 1200GS

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The TPMS on my R12RS looks different that that. The valve is located in one of the wheel spokes, while the pressure sensor (which looks to me much larger than in your photo) assembly is separate and attached to the center of the wheel rim below the spoke with the valve. BTW, the valve assembly can be unscrewed with a deep metric socket, which leaves an empty hole in the rim. There is also something odd about the valve assembly. I have been unsuccessful in removing the valve core with any sort of tool. Each valve assembly cost $7.50 and comes with blue thread locker painted on the screw threads.

    So it appears that BMW is not too interested in standardizing the TPMS used in their wheel rims on their different models as the device that you show is completely different than the one in my RS. My guess is that what you show is more likely what is in your GT than what I have in my RS. If that is the case, then the TPMS is located in the center of your rim too and would appear to interfere with the movement of the plastic balance beads. However, I have no idea if that would disrupt any balancing that they might do.
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Yes Richard, the images were from the Al express,,,, they have dozens of different venders for as little as 10 ea,,. They state its for the F700GS as well as the R1200GS I found a guy with a 2017 R1200GS on a thread who had asked a similar question to mine,,. He eventually tried it and said with a lot of farting around, tapping and so on he was able to get the beads into his wheels without breaking the beads so I suspect it might be doable given the right technique,,.

    A couple of obvious differences are the spoked wheels on the 1200 and the 700 has that crazy sideways off the rim spoke mounted valve stem,,. I'm still holding out hope for someone that has actually done it on the 700 before I order beads and what ever else is required?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lag View Post
    Has anyone used balance beads in the F700GS OEM rims, I'm wondering if they are compatible with the valve stem on the front and the tire pressure monitors? Can you install them with the wheels mounted and on the bike? Also which brand to buy?

    I can never seem to get a decent shake when it comes to mounting & balancing wheels and tires,,.

    I recall the OEM setup to be pretty good with very few wts from the factory, two on one wheel and none on the other,,. Now I have 12 weights on the back and six on the front and I find that starting at 80 mph the front seems very course & with handlebar vibrations and gets progressively worse as the speed increases,,. 80 mph is the point where the engine RPM is getting up into the 6000's so maybe this is a factor as well,,.
    Not sure if I'm expecting to much? ,,,,,,,,,,Comments would be welcomed?
    I thought I might have a tire/wheel balance issue as well but pulling in the clutch at top speed killed 90% of the vibes.....leading me to look at the engine as the culprit. I can run smoothly to about 5k rpm / 140km/hr, then it gets progressively worse. Or, if running downhill, much faster without vibes.....so again...suspect is the motor, specifically the throttle position. I have a supply of beads in my shop but haven't installed them as I suspect they would clump over time. I've read that a little air pressure behind the beads assists their entry into the tire.
    Friend uses the Ride on product, says he's happy with it.
    Greg

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    Thanks Anjelli,,. Now thats interesting, I've never thought to pull the clutch lever but will give it a try,,. Occasionally I've forgot to go into 6th gear and looked at the speedo when this balance phenomena occurred only to discover it was occurring at a lower speed, the condition improves with the upshift so I've been somewhat aware that the engine RPM is a factor,,. I think a combination of things (speed, road surface, engine rpm , tire condition & style ) are all factors,,. I notice this on my Ninja as well?
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    Interesting to know someone else is on the site from the Lower Mainland,,.

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    Instead of balance beads, I suggest Ride-On sealant and balance. If installed per directions, it is perfectly safe for TPMS sensors and does NOT leave a sticky goo in the tire. I personally saw a tire removed from a friends H-D that had a 1/4 inch bolt AND a small screw in it but was still at proper inflation. Does a great job of balancing the tire too. I have no connection to Ride-On, I was just very impressed with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rreynold6 View Post
    Instead of balance beads, I suggest Ride-On sealant and balance. If installed per directions, it is perfectly safe for TPMS sensors and does NOT leave a sticky goo in the tire. I personally saw a tire removed from a friends H-D that had a 1/4 inch bolt AND a small screw in it but was still at proper inflation. Does a great job of balancing the tire too. I have no connection to Ride-On, I was just very impressed with it.
    Impressive review of this product?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqkBfEHYzxw

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    As a retired engineer I once worked through the equations to understand how "balance beads" work. The physics is there. The problem is to move into balance the wheel has to spin out of concentric, it has to "shake" first to move the beads. Carefully read the instruction sheet to see the manufacturer outright states the wheel will not balance on the dealer's spin balancer. The spin balancer holds the wheel rigid not allowing it to shake the beads into place.

    So far so good until one realizes any knock to the spinning tire will throw beads out of place, wheel out of balance, until they get moved back. Every expansion joint or crack in the road will throw beads around in your tire resulting in multiple shakes where only 1 is justified

    Mounted my first tire after purchasing my NoMar tools. Balanced the wheel using shipping tape to hold the weights. Noted position then took the weights off. Cycle Gear will balance any motorcycle wheel off-bike for free so I took it in to see how my results differed. Was well worth the 60 miles round trip. The poorly trained store employee dutifully taped weights where the machine said to. Spun it again and was told to put more weights elsewhere. And again. No matter it said more weights yet again he declared the wheel to be balanced! By this time it had about (10) 7g stick-on weights.

    Took it home and put it back on my NoMar static balancer. Gravity does not lie, it was awful. Pulled the weights off. Balanced it again and got the same results as before the trip to Cycle Gear. Lesson learned.

    A friend worked in that store at the time but was not present that day. Told him of my experience a few weeks later. He said, "yup, the machine was broken, is fixed now." He shrugged off my disbelief in how incompetent my balance, "good help is hard to get and keep."

    A calibrated spin balancer in good condition can quickly find a good balance but these are fairly complex machines which require an operator smart enough to detect when the machine lies. There is no calibration for gravity balancers, but more skill is required, and more time. I can't help think those who claim, "dealer could not balance my wheels but beads worked miracles!" have a dealer whose spin balancer is broken. Too much trust in machines.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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    David, good to hear your pulling your own strings, I'm tempted to do the same? Finding less and less companies that do MC tire work and the ones that do are charging more and more with each passing season,,. Now over $50.00 Cad per wheel, if you remove the wheels and wait around all day to get then done,,.

    I've now had 4 out of my last five balances out completely or very suspect, don't know if its consistently operator error or equipment calibration, likely a combination,,.
    In one case it was equipment calibration by a large dealer thats been in the business for 40 years and the guy told me that everything they did that week was completely out of balance? A second place ended up putting 15 wts on a wheel that previously had two, another told me it balanced up fine and I later realized that they hadn't even touched the wts that were already suspect from the previous set of tires,,. If BMW sell you a bike with 2 wts on the rear and 1 wt on the front and you change the tires and end up with over twenty wts, I would say somethings the matter and its probable not the Rims or the new Tires,,. Apparently the reason the tire manufactures got rid of the dots is because they are well balanced as is that there's no longer a heavy spot,,.

    Looks to me that the "Ride on sealant" is a different product given that once it sets up it stays in place,,,,,,,,,,, I thought the video if true was fairly convincing?

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    Michelin does not put a balance dot on their motorcycle tires but Bridgestone and Dunlop do. I don’t know it matters but if you don’t put the dot at the tire valve then those who have never mounted or balanced a tire will belittle your efforts.

    Have been going through over 2 sets of tires per year since purchasing the tools nearly 5 years ago. Convenience is at least as beneficial as the cost. Can have new tire waiting until needed. Can mount on a Saturday night if needed. In less time than I can drive to anyplace to have it done. Helps let me run the tires to their end rather than be forced to replace when opportunity and dealer schedule coincide.

    Lots of new friends come out of the woodwork when you have tire mounting and balancing tools.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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    Also diagnosing tire balance is a bit of an abstract art while riding, you just want to know the tires are properly balanced, as to eliminate that from any other potential problem,,. This should be a good reason to go to a qualified tire shop with professional equipment?

    I don't claim to know more then the pro tire guy but personally I think the following quote from someone that does their own tire work has accurately figured out the correct procedure and the "forty or fifty dollar guys" just don't want to take the time to get it right, if they can do the job in 15 mins. they make good money and if takes longer your just a pain in the ass to them, they would sooner send you away with 15 Mac truck wts or a totally unbalanced wheel then crack the bead and turn the tire,.

    "I'm up to over 75 tire changes on various bikes and my experience is that the dot or bar code is pointless. I regularly will break the bead and spin the tire to reduce the weights to no more than 3 or 4 at the most quarter ounce weights. I've found the valve stem on the rim is almost never the heavy spot anyway."

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    I have found that wheels tend to be more out of balance than most tires.
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard230 View Post
    I have found that wheels tend to be more out of balance than most tires.
    I’m too lazy to unmount the rim from my NoMar stand to check it’s balance without a tire, then put it back on the stand to finish installing a tire.

    I might have used (5) 7g (1/4 oz) weights once. 4 a few times. Most often 2. And in about 50 tires 0 twice.

    My FJR came new from the factory with no weight in the front tire. Didn’t need it.

    A week or so ago put a rear tire on friend’s R1150RT. It had (6) weights with the old tire. Aligned the stupid dot to valve stem. Then started checking balance before removing weights. Removed 5, left one, didn’t even move it, and my Marc Parnes balancer would not turn no matter what angle I positioned the wheel. Never saw a better balance before. These are sensitive bearings that will rotate if the cone thumbscrews are not 180° opposite each other.

    There is always an outlier. Last fall a friend purchased what was supposed to be a Pirelli rear tire on eBay. What he got was unmarked. The DOT code did not jive, claimed a Chinese factory in California but the wrapper said “made in China”, the tire had no country of origin, brand, or model on the sidewall. Took (19) 7g weights. Tire that came off had 3 (which I also mounted and balanced a year or so prior) so I trust the rim wasn’t too far out. Tried to “loan” him my tire-in-waiting so he could return his but he refused. The rest of this story is too sad to tell.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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    The most out of balance (tireless) wheel that I have ever seen was the steel wire rear wheel on my 2005 Triumph Bonneville T-100. That thing took about 6 ounces of weight to balance and the front wheel wasn't much better. I don't know where Triumph sourced their steel wheels, but I bet it was from a former Soviet Union country. I don't think tire balancing beads would have helped balance those wheels very much.

    You can forget worrying about those little red and yellow dots that you are supposed to align with the tire valve. I agree they are pretty much useless.
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Would it be safe to conclude that if a tire mount & balance require more then a couple of ounces of wt on a wheel that previously balanced fine or came from the manufacture with less that its probable not the "tire" that the problem, but rather the mounting, the balance equipment or the workmanship?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lag View Post
    Would it be safe to conclude that if a tire mount & balance require more then a couple of ounces of wt on a wheel that previously balanced fine or came from the manufacture with less that its probable not the "tire" that the problem, but rather the mounting, the balance equipment or the workmanship?
    I am not sure what to conclude, other than it might be a good idea to buy a gravity balance stand and perform the work yourself with stick-on weights bought off of Amazon or some other vendor. While it can be sort of a frustrating and time consuming job to get the wheel balanced properly, at least you will know that it was done right.
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lag View Post
    Would it be safe to conclude that if a tire mount & balance require more then a couple of ounces of wt on a wheel that previously balanced fine or came from the manufacture with less that its probable not the "tire" that the problem, but rather the mounting, the balance equipment or the workmanship?
    A conclusion would be wild guesswork.

    If the tire is seated correctly on the rim then mounting can not be to blame.

    Is possible the wheel is out of balance. The tire is out of balance. And the two are aligned just right to need maximum amount of weights to counter. Similar might have been true for prior tire, but the wheel and tire imbalances countered.

    If there is any reason to suspect the wheel then the tire has to come off to check the wheel alone. Knowing if, and where, the wheel is out of balance will take the guesswork out when tire is added to the mix.

    Is pretty difficult to slide the tire around the rim. Easiest to unmount one side, then remount that side. But quite frankly 4 extra weights is much cheaper than the effort.

    Speaking of dots, the OE factory tires on my F-150 have a lot of weights (Goodyear, what do you expect?) and dots are no where near the valve stems. Valve stems have TPMS inside, so one would suspect that to be the heavy side.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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    FWIW, the last four tire sets I've installed, have not required any balancing.
    Elnathan - 2014 BMW F800GT
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