Metzeler Roadtec 01 SE vs Michelin Road 5 (F800GT) - BMW F800 Riders Forum & Registry



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  1. #1
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    Hi All,

    As per the title I'm on on the hunt for my next pair of shoes.....
    I really want to keep this thread only to these two types of tyre and not expand to further options.
    I've ridden with many brands and styles of tyres over many different bikes over many years in lots of different weather including commuting in snow thus I'm pretty well versed but trying to establish my best choice from these two; Metzeler Roadtec 01 SE & Michelin Road 5

    Stock Z8's I thought were "ok" but only did about 1500 miles on them as the first owner scrubbed most of them off (6K) before I got my mitt's on the bike.
    Replaced with Pirelli Angel GT2's as I loved the original Angels on my old CBF500 commuter, as they griped like glue right to the edges and we're great in wet/dry hot/cold ect.... and got great millage - However the GT2's seemed the total opposite, I've had a few "bum twitches" on these (one that I'm convinced if it wasn't for the TC I'd be a goner), Now the rear is square as a car tyre now after only 4000 miles (looked shit at 2000), the front is cupped like a decent bra and now handles like a Sherman tank post-battle.... they need to go...

    Never had a bad Michelin or Metzeller, so wanting to return to one of these but as we all know good tyres are not cheap (especially the Michelins) and want to make the right choice.

    A friend of mine has both currently, however has only done a couple of hundred miles on each and on different bikes so he cant really give me a long term (or fair) review of either.
    Metzellers fitted to a Honda Hornet 900
    Road 5's fitted to a Honda CB500F

    He rates the grip of both of them but says the Metzelers feel "sportier", my concern with this is (like with the GT2's) is they will "flat off" quickly and leave me with shitty handling whereas if the Road 5's are a bit more "Neutral" although they may not be as sporty they will stand the test of time and stay fairly consistent though out their life.

    Last Michelins I had were the PR2's some years ago and I remember them being great and lasting an eternity and I road them in all weathers and also on the very aggressive side at times without them skipping a beat. However, I'm currently leaning towards the Metzellers as the Michelins costing £260>270ish I'm not sure if the extra money will be worth it...

    I ride a mix of enthusiastic evening runs & 2 up rides out but at least 50% of my miles come from touring (avoiding highway/motorway as much as possible) but loaded up with panniers and top box in addition to my 120kg of muscle and dick...
    Obviously neither is a bad tyre from what I've seen (but the GT2's shouldn't have been either!) but want to make the right choice

    Really I want somebody with equal experience of both to let me know their thoughts.

    Key Points;
    - Wear consistency / profile change
    - Tyre feel
    - Millage (I know this is a bit subjective, but if the same person got 5000 out of one & 8000 out of the other it gives an indicator on longevity)
    - wet/cold weather performance
    - which would you buy again / recommend

    Appreciate this can be a bit like talking politics or religion....

    Thanks!!

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  3. #2
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    Hi Tris, I went thru the same decision last year for another bike. One of the reviews I found useful was https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1leVfe5EGg&t=293s
    Compares the PR4 with Metz R 01 (& others) & concluded the Metz best dry tyre & PR4 best for wet/mixed roads. You can guess the Road 5 would be better

    Went for the Metz & really like them (Honda NC750X), that bike mainly ridden in the dry.
    My F800GT came with PR4's, nearly shot now but I like them & I'll get the '4's again, as UK won't be all dry roads!
    Ajay

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    I rode a friend's GT who had the Michelin Road 5 and I wasn't impressed. They were a good tyre, but there was nothing special about them, and I really preferred the feel of what I was using on my own GT. In my humble opinion, you're paying a lot of money for a name.

    I've had the Metzeler Roadtec 01 and I'll let you be the guinea pig for the SE version. The Roadtec 01 was the replacement tyre for the OEM Z8s. The Z8s got me around 11,000 miles when I pulled them off to put the Roadtec 01s on prior to a trip. I was expecting great things from the Roadtec tyres. The tread pattern seemed optimal for dispersing water, and the marketing hype made it seem like it would perform really well. And they did. I rode through torrential rain and no issues whatsoever. I did some high speed runs through very twisty roads and again had no issues.

    The first trip was 4500 miles. I had about 10 days layover at home before setting off on another 3-4000 mile trip. I rode over to the local Cycle Gear store and got an eye opener. The tread on the sides looked new and deep. The tyre was clean...except in the center of the tread. There was about a two and a half centimeter strip right down the middle...where there isn't any tread...and you could see where the wear was forming. Maybe I panicked, but I had visions of what I'd seen on the forum of other Metzeler tyres looking great one day, and the next day you are seeing the cords.

    No one could get a tyre in stock before I left, so I made an appointment at the far end of the trip to have the tyre replaced. At 6000 miles it was worn out. Now the marketing folks say it is new and improved over the older Z8...but the older Z8 actually lasted twice as long.

    It's your choice, but I wouldn't pay that kind of premium on the Roadtec 01 SE after being burnt on the Roadtec 01. Neither tyre is on my list of future tyres.

    Chris
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    As Chris says, the Roadtec has that special ability to look like it can go thousands more miles, but at the next gas station the glint of the metal running down the middle of the tread is alarming.

    The Michelin Road 5 is a great hoop. It doesn't need to do anything to impress. It just spins around with the wheels for thousands of grippy, trouble-free wet or dry miles never once drawing your attention. Perfect.

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    I'm a Michelin fan through and through when it comes to bike tyres. I've tried others previously but nothing compared to what i knew & liked.

    I got the Road 5's on this year after about 6 years of using Pilot Power 2CT's. As the weather has not been great (no hot days, to really push on) i've not been able to fully 'test' them. But in all weathers and temperatures i've ridden in i'm happy/impressed with them. They remind me of the Pilot Power series with the feedback and grip levels, and hopefully in the long run i'll get the 'road' advantage of longevity (more than 5-6k on a rear).

    Downside, yes it the price. They're not cheap. But that's the only negative i've found so far.

    Between the 2 of them (although i've never used Metzler tyres) you'll not end up with bad rubber.

    There's a thread about the Road 5's to read (if you've not done so already) which might help you with more information about real world experience.
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    Yeah I've read into that and several other forums/treads too, aside from MCN & similar reviews (which I don't particularly fully believe because of sponsorships ect...) i havent read much of people who have used both and there true long time opinions.

    On a test day with new rubber everything feels like the "next best thing" - 4000 miles in and they'll all be revealing their true colours.

    Summaries like what Chris has given above about the Metz R01 are great and appreciate his comments about the R5's been nothing special. RideaMile's comment about the R5's doing what they say for 1000's of miles is great also and is my "gut feel" around the R5's.

    I really want somebody to come on and say something along the lines of;

    "had both, got xxx miles from one and xxx from the other - both gripped well but xxx had a better feel for longer (or not) but one flatted quicker than the other, I'd get xxx again because its overall better value / not much in it and I prefer the feel of xxx"

    There seem to be many people who have had one or the other (even multiple times) but not see anyone anywhere say they have had both and summarise which they believe is the better rubber and why.....

    Incidentally I had the same experience as Chris with the Z8 once worn - 100% fine 20 miles later rubber patches and canvas showing.... shit myself being 80 miles from home in the evening with nowhere open, teased it home "ok" but it was an eyeopener...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajaay View Post
    Hi Tris, I went thru the same decision last year for another bike. One of the reviews I found useful was https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1leVfe5EGg&t=293s
    Compares the PR4 with Metz R 01 (& others) & concluded the Metz best dry tyre & PR4 best for wet/mixed roads. You can guess the Road 5 would be better

    Went for the Metz & really like them (Honda NC750X), that bike mainly ridden in the dry.
    My F800GT came with PR4's, nearly shot now but I like them & I'll get the '4's again, as UK won't be all dry roads!
    Ajaay - I watch a lot of FortNine's reviews ect... I believe he is one of the few 100% honest guys doing that type of thing and he seems genuinely technically knowledgeable too, doesn't just read "spec sheets" and spout BS - the exact opposite I believe.

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    I have experience with both the Michelin Pilot Road 4 (predecessor of the Road 5) and the Roadtec 01 (not the SE version).
    Durability:
    On the rear tire, the PR4 lasted 11000 km and the Roadtec between 9000 and 10000 (I'm on my third set of Roadtec 01's); I cannot confirm the experience of others that the 'endpoint' of the Road 01 can come very quick....pretty predictable
    Handling:
    The Roadtec feels more sporty and I felt handling on twisty roads extremely good and better than the PR4. I seldom ride in extreme wet weather, but sofar I do not felt the Roadtec 'bad' in the wet. Both tires are pretty comparable, maybe the PR4 a little bit better in the wet, but no major differences

    The fact that I am on my 3rd set of Roadtec 01's makes it clear, I think....For me, that's the tire of choice, despite the mileage difference vs the PR4.

    For the next set I'm inclined to test the Road5, but the Roadtec 01 feels soooo good....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tris1993 View Post
    I really want somebody to come on and say something along the lines of;

    "had both, got xxx miles from one and xxx from the other - both gripped well but xxx had a better feel for longer (or not) but one flatted quicker than the other, I'd get xxx again because its overall better value / not much in it and I prefer the feel of xxx"...
    To get what you want, you need someone who has gone through a set of the Z8's, then both of the other two tires. That's a rider with around 30,000 miles...and not many of those exist.

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    Tris, this is something I find helpful to put together. Prices are current from Revzilla as of 4/1. You have the price of the front and rear, minus any rebate and then ranked by the total price. I also started including the "Owner Rating", a figure I find helpful.




    It's just my opinion, but all the tyres that we have available are pretty much at the same level of performance. It's not like it was 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago where there were some clear-cut leaders and then the also-rans. I've also quit being as concerned on tyre life as I used to be. When I was commuting daily, that was high up on the list just under wet weather performance. Since I retired and take trips, I'm far less concerned. Chances are that I'll swap out tyres before their end of life, because I need tread left to get through the trip and back home.

    FWIW, I've had two sets of the Metzeler Roadtec 01 tyres. The second set lasted till about 10-11,000 miles. The difference I think was that I ordered the HWM tyre for the rear. That was what Metzeler initially recommended when the tyre first came out. I've had two sets of the Dunlop RS 3's. and two or three sets of the Continental RA3. I'm now using a Dunlop RS4.

    The chart I think can be helpful. Is the Metzeler Roadtec 01 SE $224 better than the Dunlop RS3? That price difference is more than the entire cost of the Dunlops. Likewise, is the new and improved better than sliced bread version of the Metzeler Roadtec 01 $118 better?

    Chris
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tris1993 View Post
    Yeah I've read into that and several other forums/treads too, aside from MCN & similar reviews (which I don't particularly fully believe because of sponsorships ect...) i havent read much of people who have used both and there true long time opinions.

    On a test day with new rubber everything feels like the "next best thing" - 4000 miles in and they'll all be revealing their true colours.

    Summaries like what Chris has given above about the Metz R01 are great and appreciate his comments about the R5's been nothing special. RideaMile's comment about the R5's doing what they say for 1000's of miles is great also and is my "gut feel" around the R5's.

    I really want somebody to come on and say something along the lines of;

    "had both, got xxx miles from one and xxx from the other - both gripped well but xxx had a better feel for longer (or not) but one flatted quicker than the other, I'd get xxx again because its overall better value / not much in it and I prefer the feel of xxx"

    There seem to be many people who have had one or the other (even multiple times) but not see anyone anywhere say they have had both and summarise which they believe is the better rubber and why.....

    Incidentally I had the same experience as Chris with the Z8 once worn - 100% fine 20 miles later rubber patches and canvas showing.... shit myself being 80 miles from home in the evening with nowhere open, teased it home "ok" but it was an eyeopener...
    I don't think most people wouldn't try both, because once you find good rubber which works for you - why would you switch for the sake of a comparison, that could be a (financially) costly mistake?

    The better question to ask, would be what do you like in a tyre? And what do you want it to do?

    Is your bike a commuting tool? A weekend Toy? long trips only?
    What's your yearly mileage?
    What sort of roads do you mainly ride on?
    What features do you want from a tyre? long life/great feedback/comfort (which of these is a priority?)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajaay View Post
    Compares the PR4 with Metz R 01 (& others) & concluded the Metz best dry tyre & PR4 best for wet/mixed roads. You can guess the Road 5 would be better
    I think that would be a poor guess. No one I ride with who has mounted an R5 was happy by the time the tire came off. Shortly after the R5 hit the market the PR4 became unobtainium as if Michelin intended to kill the line in favor of R5. About 6 months later the PR4 returned as if Michelin realized PR4 users were not going to dutifully follow to R5.

    Two I know got 75% of the life from R5 they were used to from PR4. They especially hated the handling the last couple thousand miles. Went back to PR4 and are happy again.

    Only my FJR am liking T31GT front best of anything past 73,000 miles. Also longest lasting front I have used, beat PR4GT. Paired T31GT front with a PR4GT rear, I love it! Didn’t like T31GT rear with same front.
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    My riding buddy up north has the Road 5 and the front has the weirdest wear pattern ever. The center looks like new, but the sides are getting close to the wear bars.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daboo View Post
    My riding buddy up north has the Road 5 and the front has the weirdest wear pattern ever. The center looks like new, but the sides are getting close to the wear bars.
    If thats the case it sounds like he's been on some good roads!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daboo View Post
    My riding buddy up north has the Road 5 and the front has the weirdest wear pattern ever. The center looks like new, but the sides are getting close to the wear bars.
    Front or rear? Sounds about right for the rear based on my experience with the Road 5s. It wears just about perfect for me with my daily commute 40mi commute (20 each way). A weekend of twisties and you can see the transition where the should wears faster, but then a little slabbing and the center comes back down to match. For someone that spends more time in the twisties than they do slabbing, the Power 5 might be a better choice. In theory it won't last any longer, but the center should wear closer to the same rate as the shoulders to help it maintain a better profile throughout it's life.

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    I wish someone would make a tire with extra tread on the left! I don’t know where I find all the left turns to wear my tires out. Usually left side bald just before center. But right is less than half worn. Was questioned for shouting with glee pushing in a long fast right turn, “Right side rubber is free!”
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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    I wish someone would make a tire with extra tread on the left! I don’t know where I find all the left turns to wear my tires out. Usually left side bald just before center. But right is less than half worn. Was questioned for shouting with glee pushing in a long fast right turn, “Right side rubber is free!”
    Ride every road in the both directions. Problem solved.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ123 View Post
    If thats the case it sounds like he's been on some good roads!
    Yes but...I was riding with him over most of those roads, and my Continentals and Dunlops haven't worn like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by rcb78 View Post
    Front or rear? Sounds about right for the rear based on my experience with the Road 5s. It wears just about perfect for me with my daily commute 40mi commute (20 each way). A weekend of twisties and you can see the transition where the should wears faster, but then a little slabbing and the center comes back down to match. For someone that spends more time in the twisties than they do slabbing, the Power 5 might be a better choice. In theory it won't last any longer, but the center should wear closer to the same rate as the shoulders to help it maintain a better profile throughout it's life.
    It's the front tire, which is really strange.

    Chris
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    I think the OP has it right...tires are like politics/religion, and mileage comparisons among different riders/different locations are close to meaningless. So as requested, I'll only comment on tires I've personally used.

    I've got the Road 5s on 2 F800GTs, one here, one in Germany. And another set of Road 5s now in inventory for use later this year on the GT here (rebate!). And yet another set of Road 5s on my Ducati Monster 1200S Anniversario. Guess you could say I like them. Here's why: linear feel and tip in, absolutely fantastic in the rain, fairly supple, last a long time compared to most others.

    I've had Conti Road Attack 3s on my GT and liked them quite a bit. Slightly more supple than the Road 5s, grip seemed about the same. Less mileage, the Road 5s last me 1-2000 more. I've had the Angel GTs on other bikes (the old version not the GT2) and they are even more supple with great feel, but wear even faster. I don't like the tread pattern of the new GT2s b/c of the linear grooves in the front tire; in my experience that kind of tread pattern tracks grooved pavement.

    My Duc came with Pirelli Rosso IIIs, which are like velcro, but last only about 3k on the rear. Replaced them with the Road 5s and while they are somewhat stiffer, the feel is pretty close as is the traction, at least at street speeds.

    It is important to note that all the Road 5s I've had are the "standard" carcass NOT the "GT" version, which is designed for heavier machines and will be noticeably stiffer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    I wish someone would make a tire with extra tread on the left! I don’t know where I find all the left turns to wear my tires out. Usually left side bald just before center. But right is less than half worn. Was questioned for shouting with glee pushing in a long fast right turn, “Right side rubber is free!”
    It's the crown in the road that does that. Ship your bike to the UK for a while...
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    Quote Originally Posted by kickstandsup View Post
    It is important to note that all the Road 5s I've had are the "standard" carcass NOT the "GT" version, which is designed for heavier machines and will be noticeably stiffer.
    Marketed toward heavier machines. If you like a stiffer tire then the GT is available. However the T30/T31 not-GT is stiffer than a PR4GT.

    Load rating of GT and non-GT is identical.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ123 View Post
    Ride every road in the both directions. Problem solved.
    Always return to the same place. Doesn’t help.
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    Ten bucks says most rides you do start at home and end at home.

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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    Marketed toward heavier machines. If you like a stiffer tire then the GT is available. However the T30/T31 not-GT is stiffer than a PR4GT.

    Load rating of GT and non-GT is identical.
    Yeah, no. Designed THEN marketed for heavier machines. If you like it, great. Fred Flintstone seemed to like concrete wheels. I find the standard Road 5 just a tad stiffer than the Conti RA3, but it is very, very slight.
    Never try to teach a pig to sing, it wastes your time and annoys the pig. 

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    Definitely stiffer, and heavier. Dealer mistakenly fitted a set of Road 5 GTs to my loose wheels last year, before I took them back and got the standard Road 5s fitted. I weighed both sets, and the GT is heavier by 0.9kg (2lbs) on the back, and 0.5kg (1.1lbs) on the front.
    And FWIW I *really* like the grip of the Road 5s, though prior to that I loved the 2 sets of PR4s I had on there before, which gave amazingly good mileage and superb grip when doing a couple of 2-3000 mile tours through European Alpine passes. Some taken at silly speeds...

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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    Always return to the same place. Doesn’t help.
    So the road is only 1 way then . . . . .
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    My bike came with Road 5 GTs mounted and it's only 490lbs. I swapped to regular Road 5s after wearing out the original tires and the change was immediately apparent, they are much more comfortable that the GT variant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rcb78 View Post
    My bike came with Road 5 GTs mounted and it's only 490lbs. I swapped to regular Road 5s after wearing out the original tires and the change was immediately apparent, they are much more comfortable that the GT variant.
    Yes, I really do not understand why BMW fitted the GT version to the F900XR.
    Never try to teach a pig to sing, it wastes your time and annoys the pig. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by kickstandsup View Post
    Yeah, no. Designed THEN marketed for heavier machines. If you like it, great. Fred Flintstone seemed to like concrete wheels. I find the standard Road 5 just a tad stiffer than the Conti RA3, but it is very, very slight.
    That is not how things work in industry. Engineering does not get to design a new product until Marketing funds it. Marketing said they wanted the Road 5 to be the best rain tire in its class.

    Had Engineering “invented” the “heavier machine GT concept” then Engineering would have made a tire with a greater load rating. Tire industry does just that for cars and trucks. A 2nd generation Prius wears 185/65-15 tires with 88 load rating. 86 is the common load rating in that size but a Prius weighs more than most using that size.

    R5, R5GT, PR4, PR4GT, Roadsmart 3, T31, and T31GT all have exactly the same load rating for the same size tire. Curiously Dunlop does not play the GT game. Roadsmart 3 is as stiff as a T31, stiffer than R5GT or PR4GT.

    GT is a marketing concept to F.U.D. you away from brands who do not have GT variants. Every model of tire has its own district properties. GT tells you something about the difference between a Road 5 and Road 5 GT but nothing about the differences between Michelin, Bridgestone, and/or Dunlop.

    If you would like to experience a very un-stiff tire then I recommend Metzeler Z6. Not much thicker than a bicycle tire. This is the only tire I have been concerned about getting punctured by gravel. My first and last Z6 rear picked up a staple near its end at 3500 miles. Cords tore when I inserted sticky string plugs. Got home 35 miles watching tire deflate via TPMS. It would not have made 4,000 miles without the puncture.
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    Omfg.
    Never try to teach a pig to sing, it wastes your time and annoys the pig. 

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    10 years ago I was riding on the Metzeler of the day. At Deming NM right on sundown I was shocked to see the metal shining brightly through the now gone rubber all around the center of the tire. The tire seemed fine back at the last fuel stop.
    Needing to be back in LA the next morning I opted to ride on. All through the night I alternated sides every 10 miles: hanging as far off the left as possible cranking the bars the wrong way with hanging as far off the right as possible cranking on the bars the wrong way.

    I made it to LA with no appreciable extra wear having ridden over 700 miles without sitting on the seat. I swore never to use a Metzeler with that sipeless center ever again.

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  47. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by kickstandsup View Post
    It's the crown in the road that does that. Ship your bike to the UK for a while...
    Road is not crowned anything as severe as the wear I get on the left.
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  48. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by kickstandsup View Post
    Yes, I really do not understand why BMW fitted the GT version to the F900XR.
    Germans do whatever the heck they want. Somebody decided they liked the way that particular model tire in GT rode.

    “GT” is a marketing hook not a tire performance specification. A Michelin PR4GT is flimsier than a Bridgestone T30 or T31, or Dunlop Roadsmart 3.

    A PR4GT is stiffer than a PR4. A T31GT is stiffer than a T31. That is all GT means.
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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    I wish someone would make a tire with extra tread on the left! I don’t know where I find all the left turns to wear my tires out. Usually left side bald just before center. But right is less than half worn. Was questioned for shouting with glee pushing in a long fast right turn, “Right side rubber is free!”
    Could that be a suspension issue? If the fork was not damping equally, might the abrasion be different from side to side?

  50. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oleran View Post
    Could that be a suspension issue? If the fork was not damping equally, might the abrasion be different from side to side?
    Good guess but same either way when fork has rebound on one side, compression in other as when both have compression and rebound.

    Everyone I ride with has same issue, BMW, FJR, Honda.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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    Depending on where you are riding. In riding on city streets, left turns are always at a wider radius than right turns. Very likely, one rides the left turns faster and at a greater lean angle than right turns. Similarly, out on narrow country roads, riding on the right side of the road will mean that when taking tight curves, generally those to the left will be at a wider radius than those on the right, just because of your position on the road, so again, more speed and greater lean angle. Obviously, on multi-lane highways, the curves are so gentle that the direction makes little difference.

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  54. #37
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    Good point! Left turns will be longer than right. We don’t have to lean farther to the left to ride longer distances on the left wearing the left faster.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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  56. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by kickstandsup View Post
    It's the crown in the road that does that. Ship your bike to the UK for a while...
    Correct.

    https://ridermagazine.com/2018/04/30...ycle-handling/


    Kickstandup, on a similar but different topic, just remember that many American riders not only don't understand countersteering, they actively dispute it. Any discussion of physics, mechanics or science generally is out of the reach of the 45% of the population that voted for Trump.
    Click image for larger version. 

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  58. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by RidaMile View Post
    Correct.

    https://ridermagazine.com/2018/04/30...ycle-handling/


    Kickstandup, on a similar but different topic, just remember that many American riders not only don't understand countersteering, they actively dispute it. Any discussion of physics, mechanics or science generally is out of the reach of the 45% of the population that voted for Trump.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Not only do most riders not understand countersteering, most motorcycle journalists don’t understand it either but have learned to not dare question the orthodoxy.

    The writer knows how to shape words into pretty sentences but is mistaken in believing his writing proves his misbegotten point.

    If my tire wore just barely off-center more than on-center I would cede to his claimed cause. Pavement camber standard for heavy rain is 2%, which is 1.15°. My chicken strips are equally small on left and right negating the author’s claim of camber providing banking reducing the angle of lean. My peak side wear occurs at 15° to 20°.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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    Came across this the other day, and it seems appropriate for the whole tire wear discussion.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Elnathan - 2014 BMW F800GT
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    John 14:6 

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    I have been rolling along with a set of Road 5s for a while now. My front has 8850 miles on it and the rear 1700. My riding is 50% mountain back roads with lots of twisties (up and down), the rest highway. The attached photos show the wear. Notice where it is. There is no evidence of cupping. IMHO the front tire is the MAX. It tracks very well in tight turns and goes exactly where you point it. I have, however, noticed the rear lacking in pavement contact at times (exiting turns with throttle-up). Not much experience on wet pavement yet.

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    Sundog 

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daboo View Post
    My riding buddy up north has the Road 5 and the front has the weirdest wear pattern ever. The center looks like new, but the sides are getting close to the wear bars.
    I started riding motorcycles somewhere around 1969. I am a converted dirt rider......my street riding experience is limited to the last 8 years. My motocross bike had horrible brakes, and I can remember that squeezing the brake lever as hard as I could pull would never cause any lockup......in order to go fast I learned to continue braking well into the corner.

    As I gained road experience I discovered my front tires wear exactly as you have described. The center has very little wear - and the side get worn significantly.

    I meet a bunch of fellows who are long term riders and several of them have significant road race experience. I showed them the wear pattern on my front tire and ask them what caused it. They all agreed that I was a "Tail Braker"....when I ride quickly I continue braking as the bike is leaned over into the turn. This riding style causes a lot of wear on the sides of the front tire. On my Road 5's I wore out the front tire about 2,000 quicker than the rear tire.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_braking

    Since that was revealed I have changed my riding style a bit - and I do more braking in a straight line and a bit less in the entrance to the turn. It has changed the way my front tire wear occurs.....and the front tires last longer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundog52 View Post
    I have been rolling along with a set of Road 5s for a while now. My front has 8850 miles on it and the rear 1700. My riding is 50% mountain back roads with lots of twisties (up and down), the rest highway. The attached photos show the wear. Notice where it is. There is no evidence of cupping. IMHO the front tire is the MAX. It tracks very well in tight turns and goes exactly where you point it. I have, however, noticed the rear lacking in pavement contact at times (exiting turns with throttle-up). Not much experience on wet pavement yet.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Tyres look good at that mileage - i'm hoping mine will look the same/last as long.

    You might need to ever so slightly tweak your rear shock settings for the loss of pavement contact. I would back off a touch of rebound (and potentially some preload too) and go from there.
    BMW F800ST, 2010, Black, Fuzeblock, Sat Nav, BMW Tank Bag, Givi Touring Screen, Denali Spotlights, Denali CANSmart, Wunderlich Crash Bars, 55K Miles & counting 

  63. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundog52 View Post
    I have been rolling along with a set of Road 5s for a while now. My front has 8850 miles on it and the rear 1700. My riding is 50% mountain back roads with lots of twisties (up and down), the rest highway. The attached photos show the wear. Notice where it is. There is no evidence of cupping. IMHO the front tire is the MAX. It tracks very well in tight turns and goes exactly where you point it. I have, however, noticed the rear lacking in pavement contact at times (exiting turns with throttle-up). Not much experience on wet pavement yet.
    I have never seen a motorcycle tire cup. I have never not seen a street motorcycle tire that did not scallop.

    Run your palm over the tread, you will feel it if you can not see it.

    Cupping is an abnormal wear in one or few places on the tread spanning tread blocks due to loose bearings, poor damping, tie rod ends, balance, many things. You have seen a car, truck, or trailer tire bouncing down the road severely out of balance and/or loose suspension. That tire is cupping.

    Scalloping (and its "feathering" variant) occurs when tread blocks squirm under load. Pattern repeats each tread block generally one way on one edge of the tread block and different on the other edge. There really isn't anything we can do about it because the center of our tires is farther from the axle than the sides. When part of the tire closer to the center is in contact same time as another part which is farther from the center the two have a different rolling circumference so one or both has to slide. This loading causes the tread to squirm. Also plays a role in whether the tire feels neutral or tries to stand up or fall into turns.
    2016 Yamaha FJR1300A; 2016 Beta 430RS; 2007 BMW F800S; 2009 Husaberg FE450; 2016 Subaru Outback; 2018 F150; 2013 Tesla Model S 85; 1983 Porsche 928S; 9 cats 

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